Tell me more, at length, about those awful whingers, Dave
Q: What's more irritating that people who go on all the time about their petty grievances?
A: People who bang on incessantly about their petty grievances about people going on all the time about their petty grievances?
(I am sure that someone is just itching to make the hilarious joke in comments which would be possible if one were to continue the recursion in order to indict me for going on about Aaro's whinging. Then someone else can extend it to a further round and we will all just die laughing. Please, no thank you, Colin Hunt).
There is of course a sting in the tail. Aaro suddenly states, on the basis of zero evidence, that GPs who are opposed to the introduction of polyclinics have selfish reasons for doing so. Might or might not be true, but the manner in which Aaro is aarguing for it gives no confidence at all.
A: People who bang on incessantly about their petty grievances about people going on all the time about their petty grievances?
(I am sure that someone is just itching to make the hilarious joke in comments which would be possible if one were to continue the recursion in order to indict me for going on about Aaro's whinging. Then someone else can extend it to a further round and we will all just die laughing. Please, no thank you, Colin Hunt).
There is of course a sting in the tail. Aaro suddenly states, on the basis of zero evidence, that GPs who are opposed to the introduction of polyclinics have selfish reasons for doing so. Might or might not be true, but the manner in which Aaro is aarguing for it gives no confidence at all.
posted by The Rioja Kid at 6/10/2008 08:23:00 AM
9 Comments:
Didn't we do this one already? Most of the comments box were with DA.
Its a tricky one innit. On the one hand doctors, on the other hand New Labour. Maybe they're both wrong? Is there a third way?
Mind you given the government can't even explain their plans so anyone understands what they're planning, it doesn't install massive confidence.
...is "aarguing" a typo? Even if it is, it's a strangely apposite coinage.
No, it was intentional, though I don't know what it might mean.
We didn't do this one before: DA has. Ignore GPs. Polyclinics are the future. Then he made a case for. That's different from asserting (as he does here) that GPs are behaving selfishly. Actually, his assertion is pretty close to the old left-wing bad argument/belief that the rich are always selfish and the poor are always good.
"In the same way, opposition to polyclinics being established in London is being sold on the basis that it is somehow bad for the poor. Actually some GPs - who are not poor - are much more worried about the impact on themselves."
Arguing against is selfish; the virtues of those who argue for is implied. But someone is bound to gain and someone else bound to lose: we can't have an informed discussion until we know who is who.
I still think Aaro might be right about polyclinics. IIRC, an awful lot of working days are lost to back pain, which GPs are utterly useless with. (I haven't met a GP who would deny this.) Easier access to physiotherapy - ie without having to consult a GP first (which is a waste of a consultation really) - would probably be a good thing overall.
the old left-wing bad argument/belief that the rich are always selfish and the poor are always good.
I put it to you that nobody has actually ever made this argument.
We have had polyclinics in Australia for years - since the invention of Medicare (our NHS), really, but only in abundance since the mid-90s. There were cries of outrage from GPs at the time, but they have not had a noticeable impact either way, I would suspect. Not that you can measure such things of course.
In all the time I have been visiting a GP in Australia I have only ever been to such clinics, because I trust them more and it's a lot easier to get decent continuity of care. I think GPs don't like them out of a mix of genuine concern about the change, and a bit of worry that the old "family doctor" model may be on its way out. But in Australia the family doctor model still works in polyclinics.
There also seems to be a lot of angst (by commentators, not necessarily GPs) about the centralized nature of the decision. But isn't that how the NHS works?
I put it to you, Justin, that DA just has. And also that it's not an argument, so much as an assumption that sneaks into arguments.
I think it's a very common conceit: but that's a different thing...
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